The Mad House of Quattro (Turbo 4000q/90q/5000q)

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The Mad House of Quattro (Turbo 4000q/90q/5000q)

Postby CommieGIR » Thu Feb 15, 2018 8:40 am

Welcome to the Mad House. We've been expecting you.

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Most of my projects are done on a minimum budget (if any budget at all), and are largely cobbled together of what I have on hand. I 3D print a lot of my non-motor parts like shifter bushings, etc.

Current members of the Cannibal Clown Committee:

1987 Audi 4000 CS Quattro Turbo 10v
- JT Motor converted to Turbocharged
- Running MAC-02V2 from a WX Ur Quattro
- Pressure Limited K24-7000 (limited to 7-10 PSI right now)
- Ur Quattro Intercooler

Future Goals
- Replace head with Turbo 10v Head for Sodium Valves
- Upgrade Pistons and Connecting Rods to allow for more boost

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1986 Audi 4000 CS Quattro Turbo 20v
- 3B Motor swapped in with 3B Wiring Harness
- Chipped ECU, running 23-25 PSI on K24-7000
- Ur Quattro Intercooler

Future Goals
- Roll Cage for Rallying
- Coil on Plug or VEMs conversion
- Replace/Rebuild transmission and rear differential
- Minor lift (1 inch or so)

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1990 Audi 90 Quattro 20v
Swap In Progress:
- AAN 20v Turbo motor
- S6 Wiring Harness (conversion to 90q plugs in progress)

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1987 Audi 5000 CS Quattro Avant Turbo
- Stock for Now

Future Goals
- Planning to Turbodiesel swap with either a 2.0l 5 Cylinder or a 2.5l AEL TDI

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NON-QUATTRO PROJECTS:

1998 Jetta TDI
- 2001 ALH Motor w/ 11mm Injection Punp
- Bosio Nozzles

I'll have pictures up shortly
Last edited by CommieGIR on Thu Feb 15, 2018 10:09 am, edited 3 times in total.
'86 4kq 20vT - '87 4kq 10vT - '87 5kq 10vT - '90 Audi 90q 20v - '98 Jetta TDI
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Re: The Mad House of Quattro (Turbo 4000q/90q/5000q)

Postby CommieGIR » Thu Feb 15, 2018 9:16 am

Link for my Thingverse account, a lot of Audi related 3D printable stuff like 016 Shifter Bushings and Rotor Caps for Coil on Plug conversions:
https://www.thingiverse.com/CommieGIR/designs
Last edited by CommieGIR on Thu Feb 15, 2018 10:02 pm, edited 1 time in total.
'86 4kq 20vT - '87 4kq 10vT - '87 5kq 10vT - '90 Audi 90q 20v - '98 Jetta TDI
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Re: The Mad House of Quattro (Turbo 4000q/90q/5000q)

Postby DE80q » Thu Feb 15, 2018 1:11 pm

I wouldn't be so worried about getting sodium valves. They are known to drop their heads causing major damage. I'm running a JT head with stainless valves in my 10vt 80q.

Other than that, nice collection! After tomorrow I'll be the proud owner of a house, and possibly have my second 80q being dropped off the same day haha.
"If you can't find one, make one"

Dallastown, PA
1991 Audi 80 quattro (10vt project)
2007 Mitsubishi Raider(Dakota in disguise)
2014 Chevy traverse (It's what she wanted)
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Re: The Mad House of Quattro (Turbo 4000q/90q/5000q)

Postby Marc » Thu Feb 15, 2018 4:33 pm

damn! nice intro, and welcome!
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Re: The Mad House of Quattro (Turbo 4000q/90q/5000q)

Postby the german » Thu Feb 15, 2018 6:18 pm

It looks like you're the right kind of crazy to fit in here. Welcome!
Kirk

1990 ABZ CQ
1990 lifted CQ
2005 S4 6MT
2011 A4 2.0T Avant (ok, it's my wife's car but it's sexy and I love it)
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Re: The Mad House of Quattro (Turbo 4000q/90q/5000q)

Postby mrdeye » Thu Feb 15, 2018 7:48 pm

Nice!! :drive: :thumbsup: :beer:
Matt
Daily driver: '01 Toyota 4Runner
Project car: '84 Audi Coupe GT
Previous cars:
'95 S6 Avant, '87 5K TQ, '95 VW Golf, '84 VW Jetta turbo diesel, '84 VW GTI
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Re: The Mad House of Quattro (Turbo 4000q/90q/5000q)

Postby CommieGIR » Thu Feb 15, 2018 9:48 pm

Thanks all! They are nothing fancy, but they run like tops despite my unorthodox methods.

The Black 4kq is a true Frankenstein's monster, I hand drilled everything, crank position and speed sensor holes, turbo oil drain, tapped into the heat line with a 3 way to feed coolant to the turbo, and turbo coolant return goes to a banjo where the old CIS temp sensor was on the head coolant flange. It actually accelerates well and after some minor fuel adjustments on the CIS head, even boosts without any major knocking. I hand built the first distributor out of a 7A distributor to get a single window as I didn't have a MC1/MC2 distributor on hand. Ran new nickel steel fuel lines all the way to the back too.

The 3B powered one is a little more orthodox, standard wiring harness and engine setup, running the stock JT radiator without too much fuss, added a pusher fan to the lower half of the rad. Right now she needs transmission or differential work, vibrates in third gear, not bad but annoying compared to how smooth the Black one is and how smooth the 90 was.

90 has its engine out right now as I work on re-wiring the S6 harness for the 90s fuse and relay box.
'86 4kq 20vT - '87 4kq 10vT - '87 5kq 10vT - '90 Audi 90q 20v - '98 Jetta TDI
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Re: The Mad House of Quattro (Turbo 4000q/90q/5000q)

Postby PRY4SNO » Thu Feb 15, 2018 10:03 pm

These meat and potatoes builds are awesome, looking forward to updates!
Find me on Instagram @pry4sno

|| 2010 Golf Sportwagen TDI /// Farmenwagen
|| 1992 80 quattro 20v /// Eventual AAN'd Winter Sled
|| 1990 Coupe quattro /// Because Racecar

|| Spare parts for sale
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Re: The Mad House of Quattro (Turbo 4000q/90q/5000q)

Postby CommieGIR » Fri Feb 16, 2018 7:45 am

Some pictures of progress on the 90q:

Wiring harness pulling
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7A harness next to the S6 harness
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The 3BAAN (so called because its using a 3B timing belt setup on an AAN) which will go into the 90q:
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Some 3B ECU work I was doing to try to dump the EPROMs
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The engine in the 5kq right now, it needs an overhaul, runs rich and poorly:
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Group photo!
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If you are wondering where the oil coolers are on both of the Turbo 4kQs: I used Transmission Coolers from Volvos, which had larger piping, and mounted them behind the grill:
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Bonus: Audi Shop Cat
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'86 4kq 20vT - '87 4kq 10vT - '87 5kq 10vT - '90 Audi 90q 20v - '98 Jetta TDI
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Re: The Mad House of Quattro (Turbo 4000q/90q/5000q)

Postby Marc » Fri Feb 16, 2018 9:02 am

why not just buy a chip reader? not expensive devices, unless you are trying to emulate?
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Re: The Mad House of Quattro (Turbo 4000q/90q/5000q)

Postby CommieGIR » Fri Feb 16, 2018 9:12 am

Marc wrote:why not just buy a chip reader? not expensive devices, unless you are trying to emulate?


It was more just: I'm bored, I want to read an EPROM, and I have a bunch of Arduino/Propeller stuff from work, so let's see if I can do a read off a Parallel EPROM

It did work, had some minor issues with timing, but I got much more than I expected. I'm certainly not going to use the dumped ROMs to flash with, as I'm not certain of their integrity, but it was enough to read out Ignition/Fuel/Air tables.

I didn't know if the 3B ECUs I had were chipped, so I wanted to dump them and diff the dumps against known stock 3B ROM images.
'86 4kq 20vT - '87 4kq 10vT - '87 5kq 10vT - '90 Audi 90q 20v - '98 Jetta TDI
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Re: The Mad House of Quattro (Turbo 4000q/90q/5000q)

Postby maxnadri » Fri Feb 16, 2018 9:49 am

Hey Steve, nice to see you on the P.P. also nice to see the collection since I have only seen 2 of your cars in person. Is that 90 at Ethan's shop? I spy a lift, looks like a great work place to do that.

3d print a vent pod lately? I could use that in the next few weeks. Rods should be going in this weekend, turbo and 1000 cc injectors. I have the white injectors 330cc if you can use them after I put this build back together.

Keep up the posts! good reading
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Re: The Mad House of Quattro (Turbo 4000q/90q/5000q)

Postby CommieGIR » Fri Feb 16, 2018 10:07 am

I can get the vent pod on the printer ASAP. I will be interested in the white injectors.

And Yup, that's Autobahn. A great bunch of guys and do fantastic work. I do their IT so they let me use a lift occasionally.
'86 4kq 20vT - '87 4kq 10vT - '87 5kq 10vT - '90 Audi 90q 20v - '98 Jetta TDI
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Re: The Mad House of Quattro (Turbo 4000q/90q/5000q)

Postby maxnadri » Sat Feb 17, 2018 6:24 pm

My goal is to make next months meet up that you told me about, so hopefully in two weeks I can get the rods stuffed in and the VEMS back from Marc and the intercooler plumed with that turbo tucked in nicely....work work work. 2:15am and my 5.5 yr old daughter started projectile vomiting every 45 minutes to an hour, she finally stopped around 3:45pm this evening poor little angel. No working on the car this weekend unless I get a chance on Monday with the day off. I really have to get out to Autobahn one of these days...and I am keen to see your diesel project!
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Re: The Mad House of Quattro (Turbo 4000q/90q/5000q)

Postby CommieGIR » Sat Feb 17, 2018 7:42 pm

No engine has been sourced for the TDI Quattro project yet, unfortunately. So that's probably a ways off.
'86 4kq 20vT - '87 4kq 10vT - '87 5kq 10vT - '90 Audi 90q 20v - '98 Jetta TDI
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Re: The Mad House of Quattro (Turbo 4000q/90q/5000q)

Postby CommieGIR » Fri Feb 23, 2018 11:35 am

Cleaned up/Painted/Change lights on the Black 4000q

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'86 4kq 20vT - '87 4kq 10vT - '87 5kq 10vT - '90 Audi 90q 20v - '98 Jetta TDI
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Re: The Mad House of Quattro (Turbo 4000q/90q/5000q)

Postby CommieGIR » Sat Feb 24, 2018 8:44 pm

Painted the hood of the Avant so now it at least doesn't stick out like a sore thumb:

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Also adjusted the CIS fuel enrichment as it was turned way, way too high.
'86 4kq 20vT - '87 4kq 10vT - '87 5kq 10vT - '90 Audi 90q 20v - '98 Jetta TDI
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Re: The Mad House of Quattro (Turbo 4000q/90q/5000q)

Postby CommieGIR » Wed Mar 07, 2018 9:27 am

Well, I'd like to announce the Diesel motor for the 5000q has been found and deposit placed.

I'm going with an AAB from a VW Transporter/Audi 100, its also readily converted to TDI with a 3mm overbore.
'86 4kq 20vT - '87 4kq 10vT - '87 5kq 10vT - '90 Audi 90q 20v - '98 Jetta TDI
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Re: The Mad House of Quattro (Turbo 4000q/90q/5000q)

Postby CommieGIR » Wed Mar 07, 2018 11:07 am

As a bonus: The 2.4D shares the same bore/stroke as the more common AAZ/AHU/ALH motors in the US, so TDI'ing shouldn't be difficult at all once I get a TDI head and injectors.
'86 4kq 20vT - '87 4kq 10vT - '87 5kq 10vT - '90 Audi 90q 20v - '98 Jetta TDI
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Re: The Mad House of Quattro (Turbo 4000q/90q/5000q)

Postby maxnadri » Wed Mar 07, 2018 12:16 pm

Congratulations, this will be a very cool project. Love me sum diseasels! All that torque....and mpgs its all a win win
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Re: The Mad House of Quattro (Turbo 4000q/90q/5000q)

Postby CommieGIR » Wed Mar 07, 2018 12:44 pm

Yup. The plan is to install a Class III hitch (currently has a Class II) and use the now much more torque-y 5000q as the 4000q Rally Car's tow vehicle.
'86 4kq 20vT - '87 4kq 10vT - '87 5kq 10vT - '90 Audi 90q 20v - '98 Jetta TDI
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Re: The Mad House of Quattro (Turbo 4000q/90q/5000q)

Postby CommieGIR » Sat Mar 10, 2018 10:13 pm

Swapped out the transmission on the 4000q with the parts bin 200qs, had to swap out the front drive flanges to do it and swap the shifter ball alignment ball.

Surprisingly the rear driveline flange is the correct one.

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Confirmed my suspicions, the center diff is locked and damaged, and was causing my vibration under load. Redid my transmission mounts too.
'86 4kq 20vT - '87 4kq 10vT - '87 5kq 10vT - '90 Audi 90q 20v - '98 Jetta TDI
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Re: The Mad House of Quattro (Turbo 4000q/90q/5000q)

Postby CommieGIR » Sun Mar 11, 2018 1:30 pm

New issue is the VSS is now its a reed switch rather than a pulse generator like the old one. Gotta figure out how to get a clean pulse, as its not driving the speedo properly
'86 4kq 20vT - '87 4kq 10vT - '87 5kq 10vT - '90 Audi 90q 20v - '98 Jetta TDI
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Re: The Mad House of Quattro (Turbo 4000q/90q/5000q)

Postby CommieGIR » Sun Mar 11, 2018 7:01 pm

So, here's the parts list for the Turbodiesel Build:

VW AAB with TD Injection Pump
Mercedes 300SD KKK K24
Stock 10vT Exhhaust Manifold
Stock 10vT Intercooler
Pyrometer

The bolt pattern on the AAB is the same as the 10vT block, so the mounts will fight right on without issue, and shares the same bolt pattern. I can delete the Vacuum pump on the AAB since my Wagon has the Hydroboost brakes and power steering, so that's some weight off the engine.

Biggest initial bottleneck is boost, we gotta keep it low until we get the TDI parts together. 7-10 PSI max until we get the TDI pistons and head.
'86 4kq 20vT - '87 4kq 10vT - '87 5kq 10vT - '90 Audi 90q 20v - '98 Jetta TDI
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Re: The Mad House of Quattro (Turbo 4000q/90q/5000q)

Postby CommieGIR » Thu Mar 15, 2018 10:02 am

Acquired 4 of the 5 TDI Pistons/Rods, also Acquired 5 TDI Injectors and a Garrett T3 from a Merc Turbo.

Further research is also justifying this build, as its confirmed the 2.5l TDI head is correct for the 2.4lD block

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'86 4kq 20vT - '87 4kq 10vT - '87 5kq 10vT - '90 Audi 90q 20v - '98 Jetta TDI
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