Ben's 95 90 Quattro 20vT - now with corn power!

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Re: Ben's 95 90 Quattro 20vT - now with corn power!

Postby Grillage » Fri Mar 08, 2019 5:30 pm

Wheels got here today! Thanks to Issam Abed!

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I'm picking up new center caps from my Audi Dealer tomorrow
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1995 90 Quattro 20VT - 1994 Cabriolet - 5 speed - 1987 Porsche 924S

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Re: Ben's 95 90 Quattro 20vT - now with corn power!

Postby themagellan » Fri Mar 08, 2019 8:50 pm

Intake is the definition of OEM+ !

Nice wheels - cool choice!

Pull that trunk dent - it's too nice for that now :D
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Re: Ben's 95 90 Quattro 20vT - now with corn power!

Postby Grillage » Sat Mar 09, 2019 8:02 am

Yeah, that damn trunk dent is the only dent on the whole car. The P O closed her garage door on it.

I may end up respraying the whole car. the front bumper is still spray-painted and I have a rear B4 bumper to put on too.
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1995 90 Quattro 20VT - 1994 Cabriolet - 5 speed - 1987 Porsche 924S

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Re: Ben's 95 90 Quattro 20vT - now with corn power!

Postby themagellan » Sat Mar 09, 2019 6:01 pm

https://www.amazon.com/GLISTON-Adjustab ... way&sr=8-6

Something like this is actually pretty easy to use - You can also use some metal ones too that are long rods to push from behind.

Paint looks amazing from here!
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Re: Ben's 95 90 Quattro 20vT - now with corn power!

Postby Grillage » Mon Mar 25, 2019 7:00 pm

So lots of progress...


Got the 17z's back from powder coater
I really liked the original finish and didn't want to do a bright red or yellow so I did a matte dark grey:
Image

The powder coat guy said they can't do a clear over white decals and I really didn't want a glossy or even semi gloss over the existing finish. So I just applied a decal over the finished calipers. We'll see how it lasts

Starting with the rears, I used B5 A4 rear hubs, B7 S4 (which I believe are the same as B6) calipers along with 300mm B7 s4 rotors and carriers, stainless lines. All I needed to do to make these fit was to add a few washers and longer hardware:
Image
got the hardware from belmetric.com
2x M10X1.25X50
2x M10X1.25X75
Picture shows 4 washers, I ended up using 3, about 7mm overall

Finished Product:
Image

The only real hiccup here was that the e-brake cables were too short after the upgrade. I was able to solve this by adjusting the stops on the B4 E-brake cables.
They have a plastic stopper that clips into the lower wishbone of the suspension. If you lube it with WD40 and press in the little tabs with a needle nose plier, you can pull the whole thing out. So here it is just pulled out and marked with green tape:
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I used a hammer on the first one to gently push the stopper back about 3cm, I needed to cut the outer layer of the cable to do so:
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Image

So with that done on both sides and reinstalled, I had to adjust the parking brake cable on the other end. The cable attaches to the lever via number 10 on the drawing below. I adjusted nut #8 by 3mm and all is good!
Image


For the fronts, I'm using A8 323mm rotors and B5 A4 Apikol brackets (https://apikol.com/product/b5-a4-touare ... -brackets/) stainless lines

These fit but the top bolt is tight!
I had to grind off the top of the caliper where it would hit and also to install the knuckle without the washer on the top bolt:
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and she JUST fits:
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End result:
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So then - the new Wheels! I picked up new center caps from the dealer for these too:
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Here's the caliper view through the wheels
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So now I bled everything twice (to be sure) and I have noticed a difference in pedal travel. Definitely more fluid to move so I'm told this is a real thing.

I am working on a solution for that as well with either a different brake booster, MC or both
CURRENT
1995 90 Quattro 20VT - 1994 Cabriolet - 5 speed - 1987 Porsche 924S

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1993 Audi 90 CS Quattro - 1990 CQ - V8 - 1995.5 Audi S6 - 1993 Audi V8 - 2013 A5 Prestige - 2011 A4 Avant - 1986 Maserati Biturbo Spyder
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Re: Ben's 95 90 Quattro 20vT - now with corn power!

Postby DE80q » Mon Mar 25, 2019 8:16 pm

Very nice work! Have you seen error404's booster upgrade on S4forum? Might be worth a look.
https://www.s2forum.com/forum/member-s- ... -kit/page6
"If you can't find one, make one"

Dallastown, PA
1991 Audi 80 quattro (10vt project)
1991 Audi Coupe Quattro (project: my first 20v)
2007 Mitsubishi Raider(Dakota in disguise)
2014 Chevy traverse (It's what she wanted)
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Re: Ben's 95 90 Quattro 20vT - now with corn power!

Postby Grillage » Mon Mar 25, 2019 9:09 pm

DE80q wrote:Very nice work! Have you seen error404's booster upgrade on S4forum? Might be worth a look.
https://www.s2forum.com/forum/member-s- ... -kit/page6

This is awesome. Thanks!
CURRENT
1995 90 Quattro 20VT - 1994 Cabriolet - 5 speed - 1987 Porsche 924S

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1993 Audi 90 CS Quattro - 1990 CQ - V8 - 1995.5 Audi S6 - 1993 Audi V8 - 2013 A5 Prestige - 2011 A4 Avant - 1986 Maserati Biturbo Spyder
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Re: Ben's 95 90 Quattro 20vT - now with corn power!

Postby jbrentd » Mon Mar 25, 2019 9:49 pm

Nice work on some great upgrades! I look forward to having a working e-brake someday. Wheels look great too. [THUMBS UP SIGN]
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Re: Ben's 95 90 Quattro 20vT - now with corn power!

Postby alxdgr8 » Tue Mar 26, 2019 10:18 am

Looks great!
I've got probably 10k miles on some calipers with decals and no clear over them. Even with super dusty EBC Yellow and lots of Sonax cleaning the decals are still white and like new.

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Re: Ben's 95 90 Quattro 20vT - now with corn power!

Postby ChrisAudi80 » Thu Mar 28, 2019 2:46 am

Looks tight! Well done!
96 S6 auto
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Re: Ben's 95 90 Quattro 20vT - now with corn power!

Postby Grillage » Sat Mar 30, 2019 9:37 am

I've been reading up on the brake kit upgrades leading to increased pedal travel.

The booster upgrade that DE80q mentioned above is one option. I contacted Error404 from S2forum and he is recommending that I also increase to a 27mm brake Master Cylinder.
Conveniently, one of the options is from a VW Phaeton and there is one at a local yard. (side note - the trunk of the JY Phaeton is 100% full of gravel. Clearly someone got more in scrap by selling it with the added weight)

Also I've seen that some people just keep existing brake booster and use a 200 MC. Unfortunately, the 91 200 (10v) that was at the yard in Northern Kentucky got pulled finally. it was there for a long time too. I would have tried that out today. (though now that I look at ETKA, there are different part numbers for a 3b MC. maybe they're different?)

Anyone ever dealt with this?
CURRENT
1995 90 Quattro 20VT - 1994 Cabriolet - 5 speed - 1987 Porsche 924S

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Re: Ben's 95 90 Quattro 20vT - now with corn power!

Postby PRY4SNO » Sat Mar 30, 2019 3:11 pm

When I added 986 BoxsterS callipers up front the pedal travel stayed the same because the total piston area was the same as the G60 callipers they replaced.
Find me on Instagram @pry4sno

|| 2010 Golf Sportwagen TDI /// Farmenwagen
|| 1992 80 quattro 20v /// Eventual AAN'd Winter Sled
|| 1990 Coupe quattro /// Because Racecar

|| Spare parts for sale
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Re: Ben's 95 90 Quattro 20vT - now with corn power!

Postby Grillage » Sat Mar 30, 2019 3:45 pm

PRY4SNO wrote:When I added 986 BoxsterS callipers up front the pedal travel stayed the same because the total piston area was the same as the G60 callipers they replaced.


I just did the math - looks like I have added about 15% additional piston area

fronts went from:

G60 - 40mm and 45mm

17z - 34mm, 36mm, 38mm

Rears went from 37mm to 43mm

Actually a bigger increase in the rear than the front percentage wise
CURRENT
1995 90 Quattro 20VT - 1994 Cabriolet - 5 speed - 1987 Porsche 924S

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1993 Audi 90 CS Quattro - 1990 CQ - V8 - 1995.5 Audi S6 - 1993 Audi V8 - 2013 A5 Prestige - 2011 A4 Avant - 1986 Maserati Biturbo Spyder
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Re: Ben's 95 90 Quattro 20vT - now with corn power!

Postby Grillage » Sat Mar 30, 2019 4:26 pm

Grabbed this from the junkyard today - from the Phaeton:

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Heres the rocks in the trunk:
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Lastly, I have a set of blue weave Carbon Fiber interior trim coming from Aron in Hungary!

I'd been wondering if the airbag piece would come off. Turns out it does!
Image
Image
CURRENT
1995 90 Quattro 20VT - 1994 Cabriolet - 5 speed - 1987 Porsche 924S

PAST
1993 Audi 90 CS Quattro - 1990 CQ - V8 - 1995.5 Audi S6 - 1993 Audi V8 - 2013 A5 Prestige - 2011 A4 Avant - 1986 Maserati Biturbo Spyder
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Re: Ben's 95 90 Quattro 20vT - now with corn power!

Postby PRY4SNO » Sat Mar 30, 2019 7:15 pm

That disparity in the rear is critical.

When I did my 5-lug hub swap I also did the brakes.

Aside from the Porsche Brembos up front, I added B5S4 rotors/calipers in the rear. The increase in the rear really shifted the bias, and would lock up the rears prematurely even on dry pavement. If I was on an icy/snowy road the car would spin.

Would be worthwhile to add a proportioning valve by your MC to dial in the bias, so it's balanced front:rear. That way no matter what combination of components you end up with in the end you can fine tune everything, just so.

I went with one from Wilwood, wasn't expensive. There are others on the market that people have had success with also. Same style as the first one in the following link (not near the car to confirm part numbers right now).

https://www.wilwood.com/mastercylinders ... ndervalves
Find me on Instagram @pry4sno

|| 2010 Golf Sportwagen TDI /// Farmenwagen
|| 1992 80 quattro 20v /// Eventual AAN'd Winter Sled
|| 1990 Coupe quattro /// Because Racecar

|| Spare parts for sale
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Re: Ben's 95 90 Quattro 20vT - now with corn power!

Postby Grillage » Tue Apr 02, 2019 6:31 pm

PRY4SNO wrote:That disparity in the rear is critical.

When I did my 5-lug hub swap I also did the brakes.

Aside from the Porsche Brembos up front, I added B5S4 rotors/calipers in the rear. The increase in the rear really shifted the bias, and would lock up the rears prematurely even on dry pavement. If I was on an icy/snowy road the car would spin.

Would be worthwhile to add a proportioning valve by your MC to dial in the bias, so it's balanced front:rear. That way no matter what combination of components you end up with in the end you can fine tune everything, just so.

I went with one from Wilwood, wasn't expensive. There are others on the market that people have had success with also. Same style as the first one in the following link (not near the car to confirm part numbers right now).

https://www.wilwood.com/mastercylinders ... ndervalves


This is great feedback! thanks
CURRENT
1995 90 Quattro 20VT - 1994 Cabriolet - 5 speed - 1987 Porsche 924S

PAST
1993 Audi 90 CS Quattro - 1990 CQ - V8 - 1995.5 Audi S6 - 1993 Audi V8 - 2013 A5 Prestige - 2011 A4 Avant - 1986 Maserati Biturbo Spyder
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Re: Ben's 95 90 Quattro 20vT - now with corn power!

Postby Grillage » Tue Apr 02, 2019 6:43 pm

I had a terrifying thing happen yesterday. Caught on my nest cam - Watch this video and listen at 10 seconds:



https://youtu.be/Vz66Xc_uFw8

I cut the engine off immediately and it wouldn't start later.

I went through a bunch of stuff to try and figure out what the hell happened.
The engine turned over okay and I ran a compression test - all between 100 - 120. Low but not gone.
The timing belt appeared to be okay from the small peek I could get at it.

It sounds terrible though right?

I thought first it might have thrown the Timing pin on the Flywheel but it's there.

Then checked mechanical timing and found it to be two teeth off - yikes
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Took the Cam gear bolt off to check the keyway and noticed - wait a minute, Where is this bolt?
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There it is! right on the outside of the belt on top of the Crankshaft Cog
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Definitely ran behind the timing belt and chewed it up a bit
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So Marc has a timing belt heading my way tomorrow. Looks like it will be a long weekend of wrenching.

Just for shits and giggles I put the belt back in time and ran a compression test on the first cylinder - now 25 psi better on a totally cold engine.

I got super lucky. Now using locktite
CURRENT
1995 90 Quattro 20VT - 1994 Cabriolet - 5 speed - 1987 Porsche 924S

PAST
1993 Audi 90 CS Quattro - 1990 CQ - V8 - 1995.5 Audi S6 - 1993 Audi V8 - 2013 A5 Prestige - 2011 A4 Avant - 1986 Maserati Biturbo Spyder
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Re: Ben's 95 90 Quattro 20vT - now with corn power!

Postby jbrentd » Tue Apr 02, 2019 7:50 pm

You did get lucky. Have fun this weekend.
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Re: Ben's 95 90 Quattro 20vT - now with corn power!

Postby DE80q » Tue Apr 02, 2019 8:21 pm

Holy crap! That could have been very bad! I'm glad so far things seem to be ok.
"If you can't find one, make one"

Dallastown, PA
1991 Audi 80 quattro (10vt project)
1991 Audi Coupe Quattro (project: my first 20v)
2007 Mitsubishi Raider(Dakota in disguise)
2014 Chevy traverse (It's what she wanted)
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Re: Ben's 95 90 Quattro 20vT - now with corn power!

Postby Afterthought » Tue Apr 02, 2019 8:28 pm

Yeah sorry to hear, but I can tell you I have two cars that were off 2-3 teeth in that direction, you are probably good!
My coupe I got that way (“bad engine “ - belt adjustment was off ) and on my AAN adjustable gear slipped , and I reset the timing belt on both of them and there was no damage at all.
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Re: Ben's 95 90 Quattro 20vT - now with corn power!

Postby Grillage » Tue Apr 02, 2019 9:46 pm

Thanks for your good wishes. I can only hope the reassembly goes well. I think it should but who knows.
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Re: Ben's 95 90 Quattro 20vT - now with corn power!

Postby PRY4SNO » Wed Apr 03, 2019 6:12 pm

Holy shit! Glad it wasn't catastrophic, and good luck on the reassembly.

If I may suggest, use a Sharpie or paint pen to make a mark on the edge of the bolt to the block/head to give a visual indicator if they walk back at all after install. An early warning, of sorts.
Find me on Instagram @pry4sno

|| 2010 Golf Sportwagen TDI /// Farmenwagen
|| 1992 80 quattro 20v /// Eventual AAN'd Winter Sled
|| 1990 Coupe quattro /// Because Racecar

|| Spare parts for sale
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Re: Ben's 95 90 Quattro 20vT - now with corn power!

Postby Grillage » Sat Apr 06, 2019 6:41 pm

Good news! All went back together without any further surprises. Really dodged a bullet!

While I had the car down, I was able to complete the brake booster and MC upgrade I mentioned earlier. I pulled a 2004 Phaeton brake booster and master cylinder from the junkyard last weekend and received my shipment from Error404 from the s2forum. Really neat kit, basically a bracket that lets you mount the double chambered booster to the firewall as well as a clevis that threads on to the booster since the newer ones use a totally different ball and socket design.
Here it is mounted to the back:
Image

And the fronts:
Image
I did some repainting to the new one. It’s actually narrower than the b4 stock booster but dual chambered so deeper.

Also the bigger MC from the Phaeton (27mm) uses a larger brake line connector. M12 instead of m10. So I needed to make new lines from the MC to the proportioning valve that feeds the ABS. My first time doing this and it seems to have worked out all right.
Image

Took the car for a test drive and the pedal feel is back to normal and the braking feels great!
CURRENT
1995 90 Quattro 20VT - 1994 Cabriolet - 5 speed - 1987 Porsche 924S

PAST
1993 Audi 90 CS Quattro - 1990 CQ - V8 - 1995.5 Audi S6 - 1993 Audi V8 - 2013 A5 Prestige - 2011 A4 Avant - 1986 Maserati Biturbo Spyder
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Re: Ben's 95 90 Quattro 20vT - now with corn power!

Postby ChrisAudi80 » Sat Apr 06, 2019 10:25 pm

Nice! I have a dual chamber vacuum booster on my S6. Love it. Mine came from a B5.5/6? Passat TDI.

Not sure if it will fit on an RHD B4 though. Its kinda tight in there snuggled up to the strut tower.
96 S6 auto
95 80Q AEB VEMS
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Re: Ben's 95 90 Quattro 20vT - now with corn power!

Postby 90quattrocoupe » Sun Apr 07, 2019 3:24 pm

So the B4 only has outlets on one side of the MC?

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