The Project Pad

Im sure some of you know my handle from mg, and were likely frustrated by my constant changing of project objectives lol. Well, Im sticking with the 200 now. I tore out and installed my meth injection kit from the '88 5k into the 200 where I planned to keep it. I want it there because I am getting PNP VEMS from Marc in about 3 weeks (God waiting for something so awesome makes even a week feel like forever) and I want to push the k24 to within an inch of its life with water/meth and retain some safety with the tuning. I would like to go just beyond the IA stage 3 chipset I sold to afford VEMS so probably like 24 PSI overboost and taper to, Im thinking, 18 psi redline or something. I do have a spare k26 but want something larger for next year so that may just sit put for the 5000 for now. Philip on here is being very nice and generous by providing me with 3 different map tunes, one for his 3b with k26 and meth, that I can browse through to get an idea of the tuning numbers and other things. Very cool, but I recall Philip was bummed when I abandoned my 5k 3b swap hah. Well VEMS is my answer to that let down. I found a very convenient passenger footwell frame tunnel to run my COP, and hopefully soon, as well as the WB harness when it arrives. I want everything ready to run the new ecu as soon as it hit my hands. The WB harness will arrive with the ecu though. Im really excited and eager to get into VEMS as its been a big future objective for me which I wanted to take advantage of before the government forcefully stops us from driving gas powered vehicles or the world as we know it ends . So please help me if any of you are able to. Im ready to learn this new software and join the few who are spanking new cars with their overpowered 20vt artifacts .

BTW I started a thread about EDIGREG's basic tuning guide on here a day ago but Im going to delete that and put here instead. Oh and hey aktapod, thanks for the warm welcome. See you all at the races!

"First off, I want to thank EDIGREG for the very detailed basic tuning guide he posted here: http://forums.quattroworld.com/s4s6/msgs/112142.phtml

I had zero idea how to begin tuning until I found that so that's awesome! Anyway, is that basically what you all did then? Brake induced boost and such. I'll probably end up rear ending someone lol. So i'm guessing the base map only goes up to 6 psi (I think Marc told me that on the phone). So do I just increase boost somewhere in the boost control settings to something like 24 psi (k24) and manually set lambda to the 11.5 AFR area while in boost using the method given in the link then take logs and adjust fueling using log data from there? then I would run my meth injection and not change timing at all but let the IAT table determine the timing based on its temperature? That way no boom! Below pics show momentary launch control switch, COP x 5, and COP conversion harness installed through RHD tunnel in passenger footwell

Thanks everyone, i'm new

Julian"

And yes, this is a stock 3B 20vt with about 137,000 on the odo. I understand the stock engine is good for 350 awhp as is (must be what the VEMS GPS module is good for calculating). As you can see in the pictures, it has a k&n Apollo CAI filter system installed by me and that's about it (Otherwise stock except for an 034 aluminum FW and stage 2 endurance clutch setup I had put it. yeah that's right I don't have the experience or tools to swap a clutch yet). My $500 car from the rust belt. All it needed was gas in the tank, the ECU MAP line repaired, a timing belt kit, and new knock sensors to run correctly The kicker is I already had all the necessary items/knowledge to carry out the repairs it needed from my "swap" engine. I think the guy I bought it from hates me now since he wont see the car since selling it hahahha. No, hes just really busy and his wife and he are very sore about selling the car in the first place. So that's the story up to now, minus all the undecided project status...

Ok so moving on. I saw an s2 project where the guy ran a 4 bar 7A FPR with stock injectors. Does the stock 3B fuel pump support that much pressure or would I need the 044 pump? Any one try this route?

Also, Philip has been tremendously helpful in providing some tuning configs for me to look over. Anyone else have a good tune for a stock 3B?? Not a base tune per se but one with some grunt that could benefit from meth consumption? something similar to the mtm tune concerning aggressiveness. Id like to learn this stuff but its not anything at all like "rocket science" of which I know nothing since I studied MET. furthermore, my first question about the basic tuning guide still stands. I could really use some guidance if someone would be so kind. Thanks in advance!


two more ideas. I I didn't see the settings anywhere in the boost control PID for raising or lowering boost. I guess I'll just take the map versus rpm graph and extrapolate boost and VE (ignition timing I guess?) And lands and then carefully drive awhile in all RPMs with logging enabled. After that apparently I use tuning by statistics to correct my ego lol? That's my best guess. Anyone?

I would recommend tuning boost without pid at first. Use only refdc vs rpm. But very first, you're going to go and take a few logs at cruising, idle, and WOT with no boost besides wastegate. Once you're confirmed to have everything operating well, you can follow ed's guide for fuel tuning. Then can start to up the boost once you have the VE table sorted out pretty good. So you'll add a little refdc, say in steps of 10% at first and then 5% as more boost is made. see what happens with boost on a full throttle run, repeat. Figure out your boost vs rpm (pid uses this table) or in other words, desired boost. If you can get it pretty close without overshooting using refdc you're doing pretty well.

Then there's all the fun stuff like cold starts, idle control, etc. Making boost and blowing up engines is easy

All the while you need to keep tabs on your lambda. A little rich (.02 lambda points) is fine, but try to stay away from going lean. You know if you're running out of fuel pump if your injector duty cycle increases and you increase your ve table but it's not getting any richer.

And while you're at it, pick up Advanced Tuning: Engine Management by Greg banish. It will clarify A LOT of things.

Yes! Awesome Matt thanks very much. I will definitely pick up that book. Any help I can get on something this complicated is a step in the right direction.

Hey Julian,

When I first started tuning I had a buddy drive around and I tuned from the passenger seat. Usually safest way to street tune. Not always the easiest cause it's not always easy to find somebody to drive the car for a while. I might have an old k24 tune on my laptop that you can look at. Just a heads up, I'm on rs2 injectors so my tunes will NOT work with your setup. Also, ignore AFR. Lambda is what you'll be working with. So much easier than AFR IMO.

I never got my starting to work properly. I could get it to work well in the winter, and then it wouldn't start for crap during the summer, and visa versa. I'll have to mess with that soon...

Ok thanks for the heads up. I think Marc's customer service may be my ticket. I get a few times to send logs in for tweaking. I don't think I'll get real deep in to aggressive tuning until I change injectors or the exhaust manifold probably. Still will be good to look into those configs you send me

and lets not forget to check our plugs for detonation pretty often.

Good call. Literally ordered FR5DTC plugs for a fresh read a half hour before your post. VEMS starting to seem scary. Id just barely like to surpass an mtm tune with the w/m injection. That will be all until I score a larger turbo. Angrytaco's is looking good except for no funds for awhile.

So I found out about the N80 valve for the CCV system and being constantly open with VEMS due to not being powered at all. How have you other people dealt with the N80 valve? Replaced with a bypass valve with no vacuum source on the nipple? lol I don't have any idea except to run power to the original N80 using a vacuum actuated switch that turns on (or off?) at between 15 and 25 " Hg. Anyone have a source for such a switch? Thanks


And No, Im definitely not going to take apart my VEMS box to wire its input to a FET...

88a5tq wrote:So I found out about the N80 valve for the CCV system and being constantly open with VEMS due to not being powered at all. How have you other people dealt with the N80 valve? Replaced with a bypass valve with no vacuum source on the nipple? lol I don't have any idea except to run power to the original N80 using a vacuum actuated switch that turns on (or off?) at between 15 and 25 " Hg. Anyone have a source for such a switch? Thanks


And No, Im definitely not going to take apart my VEMS box to wire its input to a FET...

the newer boxes have n80 wired by default anyway. fuhghetaboutit.

Wow the latest firmware is freaking badass. Everything i'm reading up on is slightly outdated. Nice. Fahgottenabowt

I connected everything for COP including installing coils over old plugs until its up and running. I'm confused on this 10 pin plug on the interior end of the 3B COP conversion harness though. I only have like 5 wires to populate it with but the strange part is that I don't see anywhere in the pictures or reading about the PNP ECU having a 10 pin plug. Not sure what i'm plugging it into. The other thing i'm wondering about is the conversion harness has 2 3-pin connectors with only 5 pins populated between the two of them whereas the ones they connect with have all 6 pins populated. I think I read that their order doesn't matter since they are just power supply wires for the 5 coils?? I connected them up anyway. Apparently, I'm only supposed to leave the original huge 3 pin connector for the factory coil unplugged too.

Wow I can't say enough about Marc's customer service! it would appear that his request for me to convert the ECU to LSU 4.9 fell on deaf ears at VEMS headquarters. I'm definitely not angry, Marc went above and beyond the call of customer service and included a free 4.2 sensor! I couldn't believe it seriously! He is doing an awesome job running the business. I am 100% grateful. I didn't want to send him an email because I sent him so many of them over the past month lol. I thought it was better to publicize my thank you instead on here. I haven't even begun using the products and I'm already completely impressed! Thanks Marc!

Marc is probably the best businessman I know. Unwavering support and dedication, an awesome dude.

Ok so Im not getting spark. And it wasn't just because I didn't have the fuse in the COP conversion harness lol cuz I checked it even after putting that fuse in. I have fuel on the plugs but no spark. Here is a png of the trigger log. I think it looks right. what do you all think? I swapped the pins on that VR sensor before attempting any of this and also calibrated the O2 sensor I so graciously received . Anybody else encounter a no start with the conversion harness? Theres no instructions but I remembered most of what Marc told me over the phone. I used the 2 pin factory O2 power plug for the 2 pin connector on the COP harness and the rest was pretty much by the pictured plug for putting the pins in the main plug for the ecu. HALP! Thanks

Not enough secondary triggers. Did you reverse the polarity of the trigger pin sensor??

I haven't seen those green ignition bits before. Maybe somebody can chime in.

Looks like those ignition events are about where the secondary reading should be. I am confuse

Hey Phil, yeah my only guess is those are related to the COP conversion harness. I requested that he ship it preconfigured to run the new coils. I included some pictures of the coil wiring and instructions I was provided. yes I swapped the green and red wire so that the red wire was in the middle like the website described. To the photos!

BTW, I grounded the conversion harness directly to the smaller of the two ground bolts on the intake manifold and ran its relay's power wire all the way back to the battery under the seat.

I'm pretty well convinced I wired the wideband right since the calibration went off with out a hitch. Here's a better picture of instructions.

Do you know what those grounds on the conversion harness go to? That could be introducing noise to the system from the coils. I had TONS of ground issues when I first got mine done. I was on Econoseal so I had a lot more diagnosing to go through seeing as it was my own (shitty) wiring.

Lol ya I feel ya Phil. I'll upload a pic of my 5k's unprofessional wiring I did. Lol it all runs out in the open from the back seat to center console. Its shady as f##*¡

ya there's only one single ground on the conversion harness and it says to attach to the ground bolt. The instructions are only for the s4/s6 so I feel like I'm treading unknown waters using the 3b with COP conversion. I will look at that tomorrow. I think I'll check for voltage first Hahaha to see if the relay is even getting it. Thanks

Ok I just confirmed I have voltage at the harness (at fuse holder) during cranking only. Saw about 11 volts but I didn't have a full charge from the after work diagnostics. I'm done for tonight...

One last thought, my ISV diode harness was accidentally left out of the 2 shipments. ISV is directly wired to OEM harness. Will not using the diode prevent it from running somehow? I doubt it personally. Anyway I'm thinking it must be related to the COP ground somehow. Tomorrow I'll start by putting the new plugs in and relocating that ground.